LOST: How Providence Affects Jack’s Actions

[6:45:06 PM] Zac: no pink elephants
[6:45:30 PM] Erich: I would define greatness as character (being the same at home and work for ex.) and legacy (leaving the world better than you found it)
[6:45:52 PM] Zac: that’s largely as i see it as well.
[6:46:05 PM] Zac: my spirituality is shifting like crazy
[6:46:13 PM] Erich: Knowledge, Mind, and the Given
[6:46:31 PM] Zac: Where is that from?
[6:46:42 PM] Erich: http://books.google.com/books?id=PpI9qRXf57UC&pg=PA164&lpg=PA164&dq=%22no+pink+elephants%22&source=bl&ots=GQL5RcGgDu&sig=1W8KxPlvm6ysO68yzqZ7usp4yv8&hl=en&ei=omQDSse7K52ctgPpgsXjAQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1#PPP1,M1
[6:46:56 PM] Erich: I did a google search for “no pink elephants” its the first hit or so
[6:47:09 PM] Zac: holy crap!
[6:47:17 PM] Zac: where do you think of this stuff?
[6:47:29 PM] Zac: it’s the whole book
[6:50:40 PM] Zac: the whole concept of good and evil challenges me
[6:51:00 PM] Zac: like darkness is not the opposite of light, but the absence of it
[6:51:15 PM] Zac: is evil the absence of goodness?
[6:51:25 PM] Zac: is “satan” the absence of God?
[6:51:48 PM] Zac: maybe we should blog about this
[6:52:02 PM] Erich: yeah, and after watching LOST with the whole time travel thing, it makes me think about the sunday school teachers who used to tell me, every new sin you commit hurts Jesus more in the past when he had to take on all of your sin at the cross – by reducing sin NOW you can reduce His sin THEN – like time travel backwards
[6:52:34 PM] Zac: LOST was so crazy good last night
[6:52:38 PM] Erich: like there is no such thing as cold, just absence of heat
[6:52:39 PM] Zac: i love Jack’s evolution
[6:52:44 PM] Zac: exactly
[6:53:04 PM] Zac: how can their be providence from God and providence from Satan?
[6:53:21 PM] Zac: or is satan’s work just a lack of providence running its course?
[6:53:46 PM] Erich: I’ve started to not like Jack this season, but last night was the first night he seemed to be an actual player this season – second from the last show no less – well I take that back – in the beginning when he was getting people to come, that was okay, I just didn’t like him on the island at the beginning – he had a bad attitude
[6:54:18 PM] Erich: I think Satan wanted to do his own thing, so he does things, they are just not Godly
[6:54:20 PM] Zac: yeah, he was resigned to fate, and didn’t “manage his actions”
[6:54:25 PM] Erich: haha, yeah
[6:54:32 PM] Zac: i feel a post coming on
[6:55:01 PM] Erich: satan is like the guy who didn’t want to work for the boss any more and wanted to go off on his own, but there was no non-compete agreement signed, just banishment
[6:55:30 PM] Zac: how should we go about it?
[6:55:49 PM] Erich: defining a post?
[6:56:21 PM] Zac: no, the mission statment
[6:56:23 PM] Zac: or vision
[6:56:31 PM] Zac: what do we value
[6:56:33 PM] Zac: ?
[6:56:37 PM] Zac: changing lives?
[6:56:46 PM] Zac: being a source of information?
[6:56:54 PM] Erich: oh, well…
[6:57:07 PM] Zac: creating dialoge?
[6:57:12 PM] Erich: what I do at work when I have to define mission statements is I do a kind of keyword query
[6:57:34 PM] Erich: then I form sentences or a sentence from the keywords
[6:58:09 PM] Erich: so if we had one of those keyword maps or word counters on our blog, what would it say, or more importantly, what would we want it to say
[6:58:28 PM] Zac: right
[6:58:49 PM] Zac: growth
[6:59:03 PM] Erich: life
[6:59:07 PM] Erich: managing
[6:59:10 PM] Erich: actions
[6:59:11 PM] Zac: self awareness
[6:59:46 PM] Erich: purpose
[6:59:58 PM] Erich: faith
[6:59:59 PM] Erich: love
[7:00:15 PM] Zac: should we mention how movies, literature, and music affect us?
[7:00:18 PM] Zac: culture?
[7:00:19 PM] Erich: tired sleep sleepy awake
[7:00:22 PM] Zac: pop culture?
[7:00:34 PM] Erich: thought subconcious concious
[7:00:43 PM] Zac: love that
[7:01:07 PM] Erich: yes, we we are influenced heavily by Goonies, LOST, the Matrix
[7:01:22 PM] Erich: timing is a big one too
[7:01:34 PM] Erich: but not sure how that fits in with our mission
[7:01:50 PM] Erich: time
[7:01:57 PM] Erich: legacy
[7:02:06 PM] Erich: desire
[7:02:23 PM] Erich: growth
[7:02:25 PM] Erich: roi
[7:02:36 PM] Zac: we exist to discuss the relationship between our thoughts and actions, and how by managing them we can enjoy lives filled with purpose, growth, love, and legacy.
[7:02:42 PM] Erich: attitude
[7:02:56 PM] Zac: tweak away
[7:03:07 PM] Erich: okay, I’m going to hack on the verbs first
[7:03:19 PM] Zac: please do
[7:03:41 PM] Erich: I like to drop off the first three words at the begining too while planning.  they are always just filler.
[7:03:54 PM] Zac: ok
[7:04:16 PM] Zac: what do you think about “discuss”?
[7:04:33 PM] Erich: that’s what I’m hacking off , sorry
[7:04:43 PM] Erich: I’m thinking of replacing it with “making”
[7:04:58 PM] Erich: or finding
[7:04:59 PM] Zac: ok, keep going
[7:05:04 PM] Zac: seeking?
[7:05:07 PM] Erich: yes
[7:05:17 PM] Erich: seeking sounds more philosophical so lets use that for now
[7:05:23 PM] Zac: like it
[7:06:43 PM] Erich: …seeking to define the relationship between our thoughts and our actions to learn and share how managing this relationship can allow us to live a great life.
[7:07:05 PM] Zac: oddly, my only beef would be with “great life”
[7:07:14 PM] Erich: yeah, that was my filler line
[7:07:18 PM] Erich: I didn’t know how to close it
[7:07:29 PM] Zac: can we find a similar word for relationship the second time around?
[7:07:36 PM] Erich: yeah, you’re righ
[7:07:44 PM] Erich: hmm…connection?
[7:07:49 PM] Zac: amalgamation sounds so pretentious
[7:07:52 PM] Erich: partnership?
[7:08:04 PM] Erich: don’t know what that word amalgamous is
[7:08:19 PM] Zac: exactly, neither do i really
[7:08:28 PM] Zac: it’s just to make myself feel good
[7:09:06 PM] Erich: I think it means a random allotment of stuff thats placed in a lot together, but that is what google is for, our exteriour brain
[7:09:14 PM] Zac: yeah, partnership seems like it should apply to people more than….
[7:09:37 PM] Erich: …seeking to define the relationship between our thoughts and our actions to learn and share how managing this relationship can allow us to live a great life.
[7:09:41 PM] Zac: are you looking up synonms?
[7:09:59 PM] Erich: no, but try the visual synonm generator
[7:10:16 PM] Erich: http://www.visualthesaurus.com/
[7:10:51 PM] Zac: alliance?
[7:10:54 PM] Erich: state
[7:11:16 PM] Erich: connectedness
[7:11:26 PM] Zac: like that
[7:11:29 PM] Zac: link?
[7:11:38 PM] Erich: to what
[7:11:43 PM] Zac: a zelda reference
[7:11:47 PM] Zac: and encino man
[7:11:57 PM] Erich: oh
[7:12:01 PM] Zac: …seeking to define the relationship between our thoughts and our actions to learn and share how managing this link can allow us to live a great life.
[7:12:02 PM] Erich: legend of zelda link
[7:12:11 PM] Erich: I see, sory, forgot what we were talking about
[7:12:17 PM] Erich: yeah, duh, link, good one.
[7:12:30 PM] Zac: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1gokttuXJME&feature=channel_page
[7:13:00 PM] Zac: they are great.
[7:13:06 PM] Zac: 2 and ahalf minutes
[7:13:11 PM] Erich: I guess we do then
[7:13:12 PM] Zac: have you seen that one?
[7:13:22 PM] Erich: no, not this one, but that satan guy is hilarious!
[7:13:27 PM] Zac: he really is
[7:13:31 PM] Zac: i want him as a friend
[7:13:47 PM] Erich: he does seem like he’d be a good friend, you’re right
[7:14:26 PM] Zac: ok, i’m liking our statement so far
[7:14:30 PM] Erich: “definitely for it” its hilarious that he thanks God for it
[7:14:57 PM] Zac: let me find another one
[7:15:03 PM] Erich: okay
[7:16:06 PM] Zac: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZDqRheBu2cg
[7:17:40 PM] Erich: so, what is it now, …seeking to define the relationship between our thoughts and our actions to learn and share how managing this link can allow us to live a great life.
[7:17:58 PM] Zac: how about “fulfilling life”?
[7:18:20 PM] Erich: hmm, how about some of those adjectives we used before instead
[7:18:34 PM] Erich: how we defined life – character, legacy
[7:18:53 PM] Zac: life of character?
[7:19:05 PM] Zac: life worthy of a legacy
[7:19:10 PM] Erich: …allow us to live a life of character.
[7:19:19 PM] Zac: yep
[7:19:19 PM] Erich: it seems like we can’t use both though.
[7:19:37 PM] Zac: now, the begninning
[7:19:58 PM] Erich: …allow us to leave a legacy by living a life of character.
[7:20:20 PM] Zac: now, that’s some poetry erich!
[7:21:35 PM] Erich: thanks, but its almost too powerful – it overwhelms the initial purpose of the mission statement in the begining – but maybe not
[7:22:02 PM] Erich: unless you view it like the five w’s, who what when where why how
[7:22:14 PM] Zac: put it all together
[7:22:17 PM] Erich: who: we are…
[7:22:19 PM] Zac: what have we got?
[7:22:34 PM] Erich: what: seeking to define the relationship between our thoughs and our actions
[7:23:10 PM] Erich: why: to learn and share how
[7:23:35 PM] Erich: how: managing this link
[7:23:58 PM] Erich: where: in our lives.
[7:24:40 PM] Zac: i’m pretty happy with that, although it doesn’t necessarily touch on God or providence
[7:24:42 PM] Erich: …seeking to define the relationship between our thoughts and our actions to learn and share how managing this link can allow us to live a great life allow us to live a life of character.
[7:24:59 PM] Zac: do we want that?
[7:25:13 PM] Erich: …seeking to define the relationship between our thoughts and our actions to learn and share how managing this link can allow us to live a life of character.
[7:25:15 PM] Zac: …seeking to define the relationship between our thoughts and our actions to learn and share how managing this link can allow us to live a life of character.
[7:25:20 PM] Zac: jinx
[7:25:21 PM] Erich: sorry, messedup the first time
[7:25:25 PM] Erich: haha
[7:25:33 PM] Erich: chat jinx, not sure if that counts
[7:25:39 PM] Erich: all though its got to count for something
[7:25:45 PM] Zac: what do you think about providence?
[7:25:49 PM] Zac: or God?
[7:25:55 PM] Zac: or the unexplainable?
[7:25:55 PM] Erich: pre determination
[7:26:03 PM] Erich: I think God exists because he does stuff
[7:26:18 PM] Zac: i mean, in our statement
[7:26:39 PM] Erich: when you believe he does stuff, but I guess a disbeliever would say, “you’re attributing things to God when you have previously asked God for these things”
[7:26:45 PM] Erich: oh
[7:27:02 PM] Zac: would a post about jack’s transformation be about his response to destiny “proving” itself?
[7:27:08 PM] Erich: I’m not sure how providence would fit in the mission statement
[7:27:18 PM] Zac: or would it just be about his thoughts and his new behaviours that have sprung from that?
[7:27:27 PM] Zac: i think i may have just answered my own question
[7:27:40 PM] Zac: if it affects our thoughts and/or actions, it is relevent
[7:27:44 PM] Zac: we are pretty golden there
[7:27:51 PM] Zac: like bea arthur
[7:27:54 PM] Zac: rip
[7:28:13 PM] Erich: well from the beginning the show has been a mirror, 180 days on the island, halway through the season, light, dark, ying yang, jack on one side, locke on the other
[7:28:35 PM] Erich: jack is more like locke now and locke is more like jack now in the second half
[7:29:01 PM] Zac: i know.  lock is the “leader” and jack is the “believer”
[7:29:09 PM] Zac: it’s a beautiful, beautiful thing
[7:29:24 PM] Zac: i am so impressed that a show of this quality exists
[7:29:33 PM] Zac: that could be a weekly feature for the next season
[7:29:39 PM] Erich: huh, I didn’t notice that, you’re right though.  I wonder who Jacob is.  Jacob might be a kind of metaphor for God in this conversation
[7:29:44 PM] Zac: you and i remarking on our thoughts of an episode
[7:29:57 PM] Zac: he is either God or the pope
[7:29:59 PM] Zac: i think
[7:30:12 PM] Erich: the scientist wants to kill “God” the one who unanswered things get thought by
[7:31:48 PM] Zac: looking forward seems to be the best medicine, but wisdom comes frorm not making the same mistakes twice
[7:32:00 PM] Zac: i think that i’m going to tweet that
[7:32:20 PM] Erich: yeah, you done good with that tweet, son
[7:36:03 PM] Zac: i’m so very much like john locke (first few seasons).  signs of the right path.  the island talking to him
[7:36:45 PM] Erich: Who or what is “the island” to you? <–sounds like a blog post title
[7:37:16 PM] Erich: and Locke has crazy woman troubles, not sure how that relates
[7:37:18 PM] Zac: providence/God
[7:37:28 PM] Zac: very true
[7:37:34 PM] Zac: jack as well
[7:37:37 PM] Zac: and sawyer
[7:37:46 PM] Zac: and charlie
[7:37:47 PM] Erich: that’s true too, they all have woman troubles and daddy issues
[7:38:01 PM] Zac: i vascilate between jack and locke a lot
[7:38:05 PM] Zac: also desmond and charlie
[7:38:14 PM] Zac: who do you relate to?
[7:38:28 PM] Erich: hurley’s dad, the chinese dude’s dad, jack’s dad, locke’s dad, kate’s dad
[7:38:50 PM] Erich: who do I relate too? hurley kind of – laid back
[7:39:21 PM] Zac: hurley is like the everyman
[7:39:21 PM] Erich: I wish I was as cool as sawyer – Jack’s kind of a nerd – he wasn’t in season 1, but he is kind of now to me – not sure why
[7:39:25 PM] Zac: like the audience
[7:39:32 PM] Erich: yeah, you’re exactly right
[7:39:50 PM] Zac: jack just got thrown out of wack and is trying to find something to hold onto
[7:40:01 PM] Erich: that was hilarious last night when he said, “Okay, we’re from the future” since he didn’t know the president. I was cracking up, dude.
[7:40:15 PM] Zac: man, we need to have a lost post fest
[7:40:47 PM] Zac: ok, is our mission statement 99% done?
[7:40:48 PM] Erich: yeah, Jack likes to fix things – for a while, the providence made fixing impossible…but now…providence has lead him to be ABLE to fix something
[7:41:01 PM] Zac: that is a great thought!
[7:41:13 PM] Zac: I would love to read more of your thoughts on this.
[7:41:16 PM] Erich: yeah, that one was for free
[7:41:53 PM] Erich: hahaha, I figured you’re going to write at least one post on Jack and the role of providence in his life, how it affects his actions.
[7:42:27 PM] Erich: Or we could just copy this thread and post it.  It’s our blog, we can do what we want with it.
[7:42:27 PM] Zac: i think that sounds perfect.  it can be a recurring theme in our blog
[7:42:37 PM] Zac: hmmm
[7:43:21 PM] Zac: yeah, do you want to edit it down and we can put it up now, with a tease for more lost related thoughts to come?
[7:44:06 PM] Erich: Definitely a theme though.  Our primary keyword is “actions”.  How does roadblocks affect our actions – what do we do when things get in the way of our goals. How does providence affect our actions – if everything is predetermined, then why does anything matter? just two examples there.
[7:44:19 PM] Erich: Yeah, I can post it sure.